[00:00:00] Laurin: Welcome to the Curiously Wise Podcast. I'm your host, Laurin Wittig. This podcast is all about honoring, sharing and celebrating the natural and experiential wisdom of my guests through curiosity provoking conversations, shared stories, and tips we've all gathered along this journey. And from time to time, I'll be sharing my own stories and my own wisdom in solo episodes.
Oh, and we'll be laughing. A lot. I invite you to join in the fun as we uncover the unique wisdom we each carry within us. Ready? Let's get curious.
Hello, friends and welcome to Curiously Wise. I'm Laurin Wittig, your host. And today I have in person even a good, good friend of mine, Denise Neveux, and she is a teacher. She's been my teacher for Reiki and esoteric healing and shamanism. I'm still working through some of those, all of them, I guess. but she's one of the wisest people I know. She's got so much knowledge and she's such a great teacher that she imparts knowledge with great ease and grace.
I'm not gonna introduce Denise. We're gonna let her unfold before your eyes. She's got so many things that she does and that she has studied, and she is a teacher by profession before you retired and teaching kids. So she's really good at managing things.
[00:01:31] Denise: Yes. Teaching Physical Education for 32 years.
[00:01:35] Laurin: Yeah. Woo. Yeah. but now I'm lucky cuz she's teaching this other stuff, these energetic modalities, systems that are just fabulous. So tell us first, how you came to even understand energy and how you came to be a healer.
[00:01:52] Denise: Well, actually the universe is what kind of stopped me in my tracks back in around ‘99-2000. And it was a health issue that surprised me came out of the blue. And I didn't wanna go on a lot of medicine. So one day somebody said, hey, I'm going to a Reiki practitioner. I was like, what's that?
So I just decided to go to see this particular Reiki practitioner. And she ended up being my Reiki master. So we did a lot of work and a lot of work that affected this particular health issue had to do with my inner power was given my power away to everybody. I didn't know that. And within, I think one day I walked in there after about a year and I said, I'm gonna be off all my meds in three years.
And I was. So, as I cleared all of these things throughout my life I started feeling energy. I had felt energy before, but I could feel it more than ever that I had ever experienced. And when I realized was the energy I feel worked from other people or from nature or from earthbound spirits and things like that.
And then I just continued. And one day I was laying down as my Reiki practitioner, Reiki master Patricia. My hand started to heat up as I'm laying on the table. I'm like, I kind of looked at it and I said, you know, I feel like we're in the wrong place. I should be standing beside the table. and you should be laying down. And that's how I just started taking Reiki classes.
[00:03:33] Laurin: Mm-hmm yeah. It's so when you feel energy, you talked about your hands heating up, which is yes. I'm always talking about energy with my hands. Yes. Because that's how I feel it as well. But you also feel energy from other people. Yes. I know. Just in day-to-day stuff. Yes. So how does that, how do you experience that?
[00:03:50] Denise: Well, depends on what kind of mood the person is in truthfully. I can tell I'm also very empathic, so I could go to the grocery store and if the person in front of me has a stomach ache, then I get a stomach ache.
And I was taught by my teacher to ask is this mine? And a lot of times the answer is, no, it is not mine. I'm picking it up. And that's how I could distinguish if it's me not feeling good. Or if it's somebody else.
[00:04:19] Laurin: Yeah. That's a powerful question. And I know that I wasn't aware of being an empath until probably until I met you.
Which was what? Four years ago or so? Yes. If you've been following it all, I've met a lot of the people that are showing up on my podcast through my Wise Women’s Circle that I ran for two years. Yes. And that was how I met Denise as well. So that's why I can say four years cuz that's about when it was, when we started that. I don't think I knew I was an empath until I started really talking to you and realized I always knew I was sensitive, but I thought I was just sensitive.
That people would tell me I cried too much. And having grown up in the kind of household that I did, I now realize that like, oh no, I always pick it up, everybody else's stuff. So this question that you ask yourself for empaths is probably the number one thing they need to start doing.
[00:05:06] Denise: That's correct. So if you feel energy or you feel a change in your physical body, like a headache or a stomach ache, or sometimes like your knee starts hurting out of the blue ask is this mine? And you get three answers actually. The first answer, yes, it is yours and it's nobody else's. The second answer is no, none of it is yours.
And third answer is yes and no, which means you already have a little bit of a stomach ache and it's drawing somebody else’s stomach pain, that energy, that energy towards you. So it's a little of both. So yes and no. How do you know what yes and no is? I think you can just feel it in your body.
[00:05:43] Laurin: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:05:44] Denise: You know when something's right, because your body goes, oh, that feels right. Mm-hmm and no is like, wow that doesn't feel right. Mm-hmm mm-hmm So you have to figure out what yes and no feels like to you.
[00:05:56] Laurin: And that requires paying attention to what you're experiencing inside as you ask that.
[00:06:01] Denise: Correct.
[00:06:01] Laurin: Because if you're not paying attention asking yes or no, it's not gonna pay off. So a lot of this is about doing the inner work to really tune into your own energy. Is that valid. And then learning how to discern. That's a word I'm still working on discern what's mine, what's yours.
And then learning how to let it go. And so do you have any like…
[00:06:24] Denise: Not mine? Yeah. and I just say, I take it outta my body and I throw it into a bucket of light and it goes to mother earth and it gets transformed. So nobody else picks it up.
[00:06:35] Laurin: Yeah. That's really good. So, that's what brought you to Reiki?
[00:06:39] Denise: Yes.
[00:06:40] Laurin: But you also have all these other modalities that you bring to your practice.
[00:06:44] Denise: Yes. I bought a CD from the ARE, which is in Virginia Beach and it said the word shaman on it and there was music and I was like, oh, looks interesting. So I bought it and I, it was in the middle of the afternoon. I put it in my stereo back in the day where we had CD players. I know
[00:07:08] Laurin: Back in the dark eighties. At least it wasn't vinyl.
[00:07:11] Denise: Hey, when I taught PE I would bring vinyl records out and my kindergartner would say, wow that's a big CD. And I just decided the music was making me sleepy. So I laid down on the couch and then all of a sudden, next thing I know, I went to another dimension. I didn't know what it was. And I saw a native American who's ended up to be one of my teachers and a vast like landscape and the music actually brought me there, how they had it compiled.
And the music brought me back and I had gone to a class and somebody says, you took a shamanic journey. And I said, what's that?
[00:07:52] Laurin: I did what?
[00:07:54] Denise: So then that was it. I followed Michael Harner and Sandra Ingerman and I started reading books. And Sandra Ingerman has this book on it's like shamanism for dummies, but actually it's not called that.
It's an awesome book. And I started taking journeys and I have a whole couple of journals filled with it. Yeah. And then I got lucky and I found Dana Robinson, who is my shamanic mentor. And I started taking classes and I just absolutely love it. Yeah. I love taking shamanic journeys.
It's a very powerful thing. If I don't know what to do about my life, I'll take a shamanic journey. If I have a client that's coming and I'm not sure usually cuz things pop in my head what to expect. If I come up with blank, I'll take a shamanic journey and it helps me get my ego out of the way.
[00:08:47] Laurin: Mm-hmm . Yeah.
[00:08:49] Denise: Shamanism is fantastic. It's what they call direct devination. In other words, instead of going through another individual to tell you about how you should be in this life, you go directly to the source mm-hmm and yeah, it's a power animal. Yeah. but they're also wise.
[00:09:10] Laurin: Yes. Oh, so wise. Yes. Yes. I came to shamanism sort of a roundabout way too. Yes. And had gotten books and learned to journey on my own. But I've recently started taking classes in it from Denise. She has so much more experience than I do. And she's much better about going and reading books. I like a teacher, you know, so, so I'm learning a lot more about just how it can be used as a healing modality for myself, but also for others.
And it's really fascinating. I love going on journeys, cuz it's like taking a trip to a different world. It is, and it is symbolic, and mythic, and extremely powerful. Things can happen very quickly on a shamanic journey that might take us weeks or months or years to work through in real life as my kids say.
[00:10:09] Denise: Yes. I think it was life changing for me. Reiki was life changing for me. Shamanism was life changing for me. And shamanism helped me figure out about earthbound spirits, I took a class dying and beyond and it was just one of the most fascinating classes I've ever taken.
Mm. I love all the classes mm-hmm but that kind of like, oh, and then we also took shamanism de possession.
[00:10:33] Laurin: You haven't offered that one yet?
[00:10:35] Denise: No, I haven't. You gotta do extraction for her. Yes, yes.
[00:10:41] Laurin: Have a couple that I got work up to, but it's like, oh, that sounds awesome. I don't know. It's like taking particularly the shamanic classes.
I've taken two with you now. It is like going to Disneyland was for my kids when they were little, it's just like, oh, this is like the best thing ever! It's just, I don't know. It's just fascinating. It taps into my whole imaginary world. but it's real. I mean, and that sounds weird.
Imagination is just a tool for manifesting, for bringing things into focus as far as I'm concerned. It's a huge tool. It's probably why I had so much fascination with American Indian culture as I was an anthropology student.
And when I worked at Jamestown settlement, which is a living history museum here in Williamsburg, that everybody should come visit. It was the Indian village that I was most fascinated with. So, I know I was told that I've been a shaman before, so that's probably why it sings to me.
[00:11:35] Denise: Yes. And that's a good point. I believe every student that comes to me or person of like mind that a lot of these techniques or things that we're doing to help an individual heal is we're just relearning it.
It's not a new thing to us. Right. We've done it. Whether a shaman or a medicine woman in and our life.
[00:12:00] Laurin: Yeah. Right, right. Yeah. I have come to think that books and classes are really more reminders for me. That's correct about things I've learned in other lifetimes.
And then there is my latest obsession with your classes. esoteric healing, soul focused esoteric healing. Yes. So that's fascinating in a whole different level.
[00:12:20] Denise: Yes, it is. So to just make it easy to understand it's like sacred geometry of the body. The earth is sacred geometry all over the place.
And so to find triangles in the body and help balance them. That's what esoteric healing is about. It's a lot more than just one triangle, but I'll give you an example of one triangle that would be the base chakra. And then it's adrenals that go with it and you make a triangle and you'll find that one point is not as strong.
And so that's what's making the imbalance and you wait till that gets the strength and then the triangle balances it out.
[00:12:55] Laurin: Yeah. It's a very complex in some ways, but simple in some ways modality of healing and I'm just fascinated by it. I was a geometry geek.
You know, that was my jam in math. And so it's bringing that sacred geometry into the healing process. Yes. And Denise and I both work similarly. Yes we do. In that we have a lot of different modalities that we've been trained in or are in my case continuing to be trained in but we also are intuitive.
We're very, very intuitive. So I think like me, you have systems and you go, oh, this is what system I need to use today for this. Correct. Or, yes, I'm using Reiki, but oh, I need to bring in a little bit of the shamanism in some way for this person today. And so it becomes, I refer to it as being kind of like a jazz musician, you know all these riffs, you play all these different things and you can kind of pick and choose which fits you want when you're jamming.
[00:13:49] Denise: Yes. That's a good analogy.
[00:13:50] Laurin: Yeah. I love that one cuz that's the only way I can really explain what I do. It's like I have all of these tools and it's like, which one works today? You also are a medium. Now, first of all, explain what a medium is for somebody who is…
[00:14:03] Denise: A medium communicates with those individuals that have transitioned into the light. With that also you are able to see or sense earthbound spirits. And most of them majority of them 9 out of 10 are the earthbound spirits that haven't transitioned to the light are actually exactly the way they were when they were on earth. Mm-hmm the other 10% are probably, you know, not fun.
[00:14:33] Laurin: Mm. Denise has a term she uses that is unfun. So I like that. I use that a lot now. I know something's unfun
[00:14:43] Denise: if you give them a stronger word than that, then it increases their power mm-hmm so I certainly don't wanna do that.
[00:14:49] Laurin: No, no. How did you learn that you could do that or did you just always know?
[00:14:54] Denise: Well, I was actually in a school and I was sitting in the office and this guy, a tall, tall man with a gray beard walked through the office and I looked around, I was sitting down, he walked behind me and then he walked out the door and I told the secretary, I said, who is that?
And she goes, who was what? I said that tall man with the blue jacket that just walked through. The secretary looked at me. I could tell by the look on her face that she didn't see it. And I was like, that was a man that walked through you didn't see it. And she goes, Nope. and I got up and I left. So, that was the first time I actually saw a earthbound spirit. I live in Virginia and there are civil war in whatever kind of war all over the place. And there are places I just can't go. It's just too much. Yeah. Yeah. There is a terminology called being a psychopump and being a psychopump is an individual that helps those transition into the light.
Mm-hmm not all of them want to go. But if I come out of the hospital, I will turn around and I will see sometimes there's two people who have died or there maybe there could be sometimes a dozen. Mm. And which is why I don't like going to hospital very much, but they follow me and they follow me or any, I don't know how they know mm-hmm
So before I get in my car, I have a conversation, I have assigned a special angel to assist me in helping them transition. So I don't bring 'em home with me. Yeah.
[00:16:30] Laurin: Yeah.
[00:16:30] Denise: That's what I do. That's almost like a it's not a daily thing for me, but it happens quite often.
[00:16:37] Laurin: Tell them the story of my mother after she passed.
[00:16:40] Denise: I can't remember what she said to me.
[00:16:43] Laurin: She was pissed off at you cuz you had helped me do something I can't.
[00:16:48] Denise: Yes.
[00:16:50] Laurin: My mom was a force to be reckoned with, but yeah, she showed up in your front yard, I think when you were out doing yard work. How did you get rid of her? Do you?
[00:16:54] Denise: Yes. Yeah. I didn't, I didn't. I just try and help them understand that they're not here anymore. And sometimes if they don't transition into the light, they just have a few more things. They might go to their loved ones and finish some work that they didn't. But I encourage them most of the time and I usually send an angel with them to make sure that they go where they need to go. and not all of 'em goes, but she did. She chilled. Yeah.
[00:17:24] Laurin: She actually showed up in this room a few days after she passed. Yes. Because she needed her sister to have a message. And I have done a little bit of this work, but only with family members.
[00:17:35] Denise: Most of the time I can tune them out, but then there are sometimes they just, I had done a mediumship reading over the phone and I was driving back from the store and there was a man on my car.
Oh, I remember this. Yeah. So, and he was banging on my car and I actually heard the bang like loud, and I couldn't understand why the cars were on me weren't tooting, there's a man on your car. So, you know, I opened up my sunroof and now I could see him and I'm like…
[00:18:04] Laurin: It's a wild and willy life you made.
[00:18:09] Denise: Yeah. So I pulled up in my garage and I stood at the door before getting in the kitchen. Usually, I don't even let him in that freely, but he's on my car. And I was like, what? He said, I want you to give my children a message. And I'm like, okay you need to find them, give them a way to find me other than I'm not gonna do that.
Mm-hmm , I don't do that. Yeah. Yeah. Mm. But, but that's crazy. And so truly welcome to my life. Yeah. Yeah. It's not a miserable thing. It is what it is now. Right. I didn't like it at first, but…
[00:18:42] Laurin: yeah, it can be a little startling. To see people who have pass over.
[00:18:48] Denise: Yes,
[00:18:50] Laurin: yeah, I've only, done that a couple times and it's been family members for sure. So let's turn to your teaching. Yes. Because you mentioned earlier that you were an elementary school Phys. Ed. teacher, and I know you bring a lot of that experience. You do when you're wrangling the rest of us.
[00:19:06] Denise: I don't need a whistle.
[00:19:11] Laurin: No, you don't need a whistle. actually,
[00:19:14] Denise: I didn't use a whistle when I taught, I used one of those little plastic whistle things with three holes in it.
[00:19:20] Laurin: Oh, like an Ocarina.
[00:19:22] Denise: Yeah. So just cause that way it wasn't so loud. Yeah. The kids loved it, so yeah.
[00:19:26] Laurin: Anything for the kids. what did you start teaching first?
[00:19:29] Denise: I started teaching Reiki first,
[00:19:30] Laurin: Reiki First. Okay.
[00:19:32] Denise: And that's also a real interesting experience because I hadn't planned on it at all. I didn't really, it wasn't something I wanted to do. I just needed to deal with this gift I have and figure out what I'm gonna do with it.
And I still have a fulltime job. I went to the gym and met this yoga instructor and she goes, I hear you teach Reiki. I said, no, I don't teach Reiki. She goes, yes, you do. Cuz I want you to teach me.
[00:19:58] Laurin: The universe will get you messages, won't it?
[00:20:00] Denise: This is exactly what happened. So I scheduled a class, I had three people sign up for it. And the person that said I was gonna teach her, didn't even take the class.
[00:20:12] Laurin: Yeah, that was definitely a message.
[00:20:13] Denise: It was just a message. She was the messenger.
[00:21:16] Laurin: Yes.
[00:20:17] Denise: My confidence wasn't that great when I first started. And then I became comfortable teaching it. And I think as time went on, one of the biggest things I realized and that I learned from my students, I have to pay attention to them. No matter who they are. What do I need to learn from here?
And, it's not that I wasn't listening to them cuz I was, but I needed to listen to them on a deeper level and understand how they're gonna grasp this concept. And what I did was realize that everybody learns in their own way. And I already knew that. And everybody has their own way of interpreting things.
And then with that interpretation, doing the energy work. So I had to leave it to them. I'm gonna give you okay. A, B and C. This is what you need to know. Mm-hmm and you go ahead and do it because this is gonna be the Laurin energy work. Mm-hmm it's not gonna be Denise mm-hmm mm-hmm. And that is how over the years I've transformed into that kind of a teacher.
[00:21:15] Laurin: Yeah. Yeah. It is interesting. She only does small classes, which is wonderful. Yeah. And it's very experiential. Which I love yes. With a coach standing by, you know.
You're very good at it. And I really appreciate that you do this for small groups because it really, I see some Reiki classes that look like they've got 20 people in 'em and that wouldn't work for me but right.
[00:21:38] Denise: It works for some people mm-hmm. Through this pandemic, people started doing the Reiki classes online and I think that's okay.
[00:21:44] Laurin: Mm-hmm
[00:21:45] Denise: It's not for me.
[00:21:45] Laurin: Mm-hmm mm-hmm
[00:21:46] Denise: I think the attunements are really what makes Reiki. There are many, many lineages of Reiki. Azui was the main guy that channeled the information and then you have a tree just like any other ancestral tree.
[00:22:03] Laurin: Right.
[00:22:04] Denise: And the tree I follow along is the Raku Kei energy Raku Kei Reiki. Ishi Curro and Robertson, those two are the ones that kind of shifted to that. And in that lineage, we do four Reiki attunement for Reiki one, two in the morning, two in the afternoon. Mm-hmm and what is like so amazing to see is the transformation of these students from the first attunement to the second, to the third, to the fourth.
And I've had people who have taken Reiki and once again, I'm not judging anybody else's teaching ability or lineage or anything. All I know is that when they come and they take Reiki one again and have the four attunement they can feel it within themselves.
[00:22:50] Laurin: Mm-hmm
[00:22:50] Denise: of how it cleared a lot of energy and stuff.
[00:22:53] Laurin: Yeah.
[00:22:54] Denise: From them. Reiki two is a two double two minutes. So it's still four, two minutes, I go around twice